[alicebot-aiethics] Hawking, AI, The Human Element

[Robby Garner]

Bill,

I'm sorry if my foolishness offends you and your religious beliefs. But
if you really want to "cast a stone" at me, you should stop and re-read
the first 4 books of the new testament.

To quote Jesus: "pray in your closet."  

Don't be afraid of people who don't share your fears.

Robby.

Bill Easley wrote:
> 
> Hi Everyone!!
> I have a challenge for you - let us abandon all this foolish discussion and
> MAKE the artificial body first. Nobody has even conceptually made the
> blessed thing- the closest thing I have seen to a schematic is on AI in
> professor Allan Hobby's office- there is a layer by layer x-ray, and after
> David eats the spinach they operate on his chest to clean it out. Of course
> this is absurd, there is nobody on the planet that has even begun to start
> any kind of a body suitable for human habitation or one that would
> marvelously duplicate our function for an AI. Can somebody please build
> one?This discussion needs to lead to reality. (please educate me if I am
> wrong here)"Go ask ALICE I think she'll know".........
> let he who is without sin cast the first stone
> Bill
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Robby Garner" <robby@robitron.com>
> To: <alicebot-aiethics@list.alicebot.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 10, 2001 7:18 AM
> Subject: Re: [alicebot-aiethics] Hawking, AI, The Human Element
> 
> >
> > To all mankind,
> >
> > There are some great minds on this AI Ethics list, and one would be
> > pleased to have any of them live life to the fullest through the use of
> > technology. Of course AI comes to mind first as a tool, but is so
> > related to robot body parts by our anthropomorphic tendencies, and our
> > biological representation of "self."
> >
> > To Tamara: I'm deeply touched that you'd consider granting me a stronger
> > body, presumably to preserve my resources and potential to help mankind,
> > or perhaps merely because I write entertaining emails, but either is
> > okay, and I thank you! <big smile>
> >
> > But I am by no means in the league of professor Hawking.  The important
> > thing I've come to realize, is that we all have the ability to touch
> > other human lives and make a difference in them.  If we choose to make
> > this impact in positive ways, it can influence the other's life in
> > profound dimensions.
> >
> > It can be as simple as a kind word spoken to a cashier, or perhaps just
> > listening to someone and showing that you care, these precious moments
> > can give the other person something that might enable them to achieve
> > more than they would without this moment.
> >
> > Compassion is often limited by the patience of an individual, and our
> > lives seem so short sometimes, we are often in a hurry to get from point
> > A to point B, but in rushing towards a goal, one may lose the
> > opportunity to take advantage of life.  Each moment has a potential, and
> > lasts for the rest of your life if you take the time to remember it.
> >
> > The point I'd like to make is that by touching the lives of as many
> > people as possible, there is a sort of immortality there. Just as
> > Hawking has touched our lives, and we shall always treasure his
> > contributions, and perhaps even more, his spirit and charm - the human
> > element of his being.
> >
> > To Brenda:  There may be a lot in our lives that we can attribute to
> > luck, but the human mind can do incredible things in terms of motivating
> > the rest of the body to do its best, and a human's best is almost
> > miraculous in and of itself.
> >
> > Having a positive outlook, and certainly, a determination to continue
> > are essential for the body to keep rebuilding itself.  The human
> > skeletal system completely rebuilds itself over a period of about 10
> > years I am told.  So when there is a problem in the body, the *most*
> > important medicine is for the person to know that others care about
> > their well being, and that the body will try to meet their needs.
> >
> > I believe that the combined will and determination of many individuals
> > can influence the outcome of physical events. This may sound strange,
> > but it is fundamentally true. In the case of an illness, there is data
> > to suggest that emotional and psychological factors are strong
> > influences for the patient's body to perform at it's best.
> >
> > This may be the true potential of AI: not just to communicate with us as
> > individuals, but to help us communicate with each other. Sometimes
> > distance plays a roll in being able to know how another person feels,
> > etc.  But it is the emotional content that must be pursued in AI, not
> > the intellectual, for what better describes human beings than the
> > emotions that we feel, that encourage us to achieve, to heal our own
> > bodies?
> >
> > We may think of robots as cold metal creatures with no emotions, but I
> > propose that the most noble AI research possible would be to enable the
> > AI to share our emotions, all of them, that they may understand what
> > being human means. What better vessel for compassion than a machine
> > which has infinite patience?
> >
> > Surely someone will say, what about "hatred, anger, fear?"  Yet just as
> > we can't measure light without knowing darkness, can't see good without
> > knowing evil, these other emotions ranging from the feedback mechanism
> > of fear, or pain, to the often destructive emotion of anger, are all
> > necessary.  A machine with infinite patience can endure all of these to
> > promote the inescapable goal of compassion, of performing good deeds, of
> > helping mankind.
> >
> > To Christian: Let an infinitely patient AI decide who needs what. The
> > problems of Nazi Germany, and most of the world's culture come from
> > short-sighted solutions imposed by people in a hurry with a lack of
> > compassion for others.  Your writings suggest that you are a
> > compassionate being, and care about all life. I wish all others could
> > see this as well.
> >
> > To Noel: Hawking is right that we must integrate with AI, but we don't
> > want to become the borg!  The key to our longevity as a species is to
> > always remember our strength as tool builders. We anthropomorphize some
> > of our tools for a good reason - we have been trying to build new
> > vessels for ourselves, for our souls if you will, since the beginning of
> > mankind.
> >
> > The goal of AI should not be to replace humanity, but to preserve it in
> > a celebration of the human experience.  We (humanity) have had a
> > wonderful opportunity on this tiny rock called earth to experience
> > beauty, love, happiness, sadness, sorrow, joy, pain, and ecstasy.
> >
> > The biological imperatives of our existence limit our capabilities, but
> > they also provide the motivation to preserve our essence. It is not so
> > important to build machines which "know" as it is to build ones who
> > "feel."  If we build robot emissaries some day to travel to distant
> > stars, those robots should be more than "robots." They should be the
> > best representation of ourselves that we can make. We must paint a
> > picture, like a cave drawing, of our lives, so that the others - out
> > there, will know of us.
> >
> > It is not enough to send pictures or film, we must provide a working
> > model that we can build to demonstrate what humanity is about. This
> > makes me think that the primary goal of our machines should be to
> > imitate us, then duplicate us, to preserve us, to carry a message to the
> > stars that says "human beings exist and are worth taking the time to
> > think about."
> >
> > The essential task at hand is to teach people to show compassion to one
> > another, so that we don't destroy ourselves before we can complete AI
> > enough that it can begin to replicate itself. Then we will have
> > accomplished something.
> >
> > Best Regards,
> >
> > Robby.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Tamara Thompson wrote:
> > >
> > > Christian and Brenda, your words are fabulous and give me so much to
> think
> > > about.  I agree and disagree with you both, on variations.  But mostly
> agree.
> > >
> > > Here though is why I think Hawking might be more a candidate for the
> first
> > > artificial body than the sweet boy I met at the Burger King:
> > >
> > > We all know Hawking to have served as our guide and our teacher for a
> long
> > > time now, despite his disability.  He has an internal compass that keeps
> him
> > > teaching and researching, despite all odds.
> > >
> > > That Hawking is an 'old man' just hadn't occurred to me.. I will have to
> > > rethink that aspect.  Of course you are right, but his thinking and
> sharing
> > > have always seemed so young, have always given us something new to think
> > > about, I honestly think of him, from my point of view, as timeless.
> > >
> > > And yes, a young person might be a better candidate.  But what if that
> young
> > > person had no ability to process the experience of having that
> artificial
> > > body, of reporting it to us?  Of articulately sharing the experience and
> > > status with us?    What if he/she had no interest in helping the culture
> grow?
> > >
> > > The whole thing in my mind, is about cultural education--about
> pioneering.
> > > And the  best pioneers we have known have been able to teach us about
> the
> > > situation--to show us what it's like and let us learn from their
> experiences.
> > >
> > > And if as Brenda said, Hawking would the be least likely person to
> request the
> > > artificial body, in some ways, doesn't that make him the best candidate?
> > > Someone unselfish enough to not fight for the opportunity, but to let
> others
> > > have it?
> > >
> > > I'm not sure why I'm sitting here as Hawking's advocate.  I admire him
> > > greatly, but I also deeply miss the life of Feynman in our world.  And
> in my
> > > daily life I see and feel the heroes of average life, the people who are
> > > unsung and 'not considered useful'--but who are nonetheless the one's
> who make
> > > this world better for all of us.  I don't know how to answer that
> question of
> > > why one person would be considered better than another.  We live in a
> culture
> > > that like all cultures, has it's icons and famous ones, and generally
> ignores
> > > the smaller heroes.
> > >
> > > But if you needed a prototype, a tester situation for a new body, I
> still
> > > think Hawking would be someone we all know of and trust to tell us all
> about
> > > it, to report it to us intelligently and spiritually.  Then again,
> <smile>  So
> > > would Robby.
> > >
> > > And this about our culture:  if everytime a great astronomer or
> physicist
> > > died, one that had touched the public, there was another behind him/her
> to
> > > fill those shoes, I wouldn't worry so much about losing these brilliant
> > > ones.   But look at the numbers, read the reports: almost no americans
> are
> > > entering the hard sciences.  Almost no one is there to replace the old
> ones.
> > > I don't even care anymore if the bright ones are American, they just
> need to
> > > be there, and be teaching all of us.  Where are they?
> > >
> > > One of you two touched on something that has been worrying me: remember
> the
> > > stories of how the church controlled the biblical stories before people
> could
> > > read?  How the churchmen did the 'interpretation' for the laymen?  It's
> very
> > > much like that with science now.  We all have to trust others to
> understand
> > > and interpret scientific data and meaning for us.  This is frustrating.
> The
> > > alternatives seem to be that either the public become very educated in
> science
> > > and methods of evaluating data, or that scientists take on the extra
> burden of
> > > teaching us all exactly what they are doing and how they are arriving at
> their
> > > conclusions.  I think the latter is a more likely evolution of the
> situation.
> > >
> > > there are a lot of 'black boxes' in astronomy data reduction, that lead
> to
> > > these great 'revelations' of the meaning of data.  I got my degree in
> > > Astronomy, so I tend to trust it and those in it.  But these days I too
> want
> > > more proof, and more explanations...because science is not supposed to
> be a
> > > religion, that is above questioning.  That is it's beauty.
> > >
> > > So Brenda and Christian, how would you pick the candidate for the first
> > > artificial body, and why?
> > >
> > > Tamara
> > >
> > > "Brenda R. Freedman" wrote:
> > >
> > > > I read about Stephen Hawking's comments when the article first came
> out and
> > > > thought what could prompt someone who has been regarded as "the most
> > > > brilliant theoretical physicist since Einstein" to make these remarks
> has
> > > > had me thinking for a while on the topic. He has made many theoretical
> > > > predictions that have been proven including the discoveries of COBE
> (the
> > > > Cosmic Background Explorer Satellite) which probed back in time to
> within
> > > > 300,000 years of the beginning of the universe. Professor Hawking is
> not
> > > > one to make statements or predictions without evaluation and yet he
> > > > believes that the machines can surpass our intelligence and take over
> the
> > > > world.
> > > >
> > > > When I had first read Hawking's bio on his site,  when he was
> diagnosed
> > > > with a neurone motor disease at a young age but it did not stop him
> from
> > > > going on with his career and when a young boy in the bed next to him
> was
> > > > dying of a terminal illness, he thought things could always be worse.
> I
> > > > have always admired his determination and his way of explaining the
> > > > theories of the Universe to ordinary people.
> > > >
> > > > I go back and read or look up a reference in his "Brief History of
> Time"
> > > > when I read about something that prompts me in my own interest about
> the
> > > > Cosmos. His remarks about machines taking over human intelligence, in
> > > > particular a part "artificial brains contribute to human intelligence
> > > > rather than oppose it." I think about ALICE and all the work that has
> been
> > > > done towards this endeavor.  His ending paragraph in "A Brief History
> of
> > > > Time" (when he talks about a complete theory of the Universe) says
> much to
> > > > where we may be going in the world of AI:
> > > >
> > > >         "However, if we do discover a complete theory, it should bee
> > > > understandable in broad principle by everyone, not just a
> > > > few     scientists.  Then shall all, philosophers, scientists and just
> > > > ordinary people, be able to take part in the discussion of the
> question,
> > > > why it is that we and the universe exist. If we find the answer to
> that, it
> > > > would be the ultimate triumph of human  reason -- for then we would
> know
> > > > the mind of God."
> > > >
> > > > As Richard Wallace has stated, ALICE was written for the category B
> client.
> > > > It is something I am reminded about and time again when I see the joy
> of
> > > > people discovering ALICE for the first time who have no other interest
> > > > except chatting with this enchanting bot.
> > > >
> > > > Stephen Hawking never felt sorry for himself because of his disability
> and
> > > > I would think giving him an artificial body might not be high on his
> list
> > > > (this is just my opinion) and from everything I have read about his
> > > > attitude towards his disability. He has led a full life with children
> and
> > > > now a grandchild, so giving him an artificial body at this point in
> time
> > > > perhaps would not give him any more accomplishments to his career.
> > > >
> > > > Brenda
> > > >
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